What Are Fiduciary Services? With Fiduciary Karyn Stiles

0:03 Okay welcome to Probate Weekly I'm Bill Gross at Bill Gross probate social media and Bill Gross probate if you want to find my website and welcome to Probate Weekly which is welcome to Probate Weekly whoa let's get the volume off of that technology man it's always something so we do this every Thursday morning live at 9 a.m. Pacific time and we live stream it on YouTube but you can come on the zoom call if you're interested in coming in the zoom you can register at Probate Weekly.com www.probateweekly.com if you do that you can reminders invites to YouTube replays as well as op you come in on the zoom live and the reason we do the zoom live is as I coach real estate agents in the space and even attorneys about making their own content as well as doing business development talking to people is a critical skill it's a critical activity and so the idea here is we have guests here who life we could do this easily on another format but by do this so you guys can ask questions so if you have questions you want to ask our guests or me raise your hand in the chat box using the zoom hand raised tool or put a note in there in the chat box or if you're brave just unmute yourself and jump in and we'll work it in when we can I see Karen camera off and muted I don't know she's ready to jump in there Karen whenever you're ready we're ready for you there she is ready B there we are with a big smile so really excited today to have our guest Karen Styles and Karen is a professional fiduciary with Lin fiduciary services and I think one of the things we opportunities here that we don't talk about probate is because the probate real estate industry is dominated by companies that sell data they just sell us to people who' have already filed probate which are either going to be attorneys so tell you co call attorneys that's a tough road or families who've already filed probate who decide they don't need help and you're trying to talk them into it and there's some there's some value there but I think as you go up the food chain you look for people who have problems people

2:07 Bigger assets have bigger problems and often times those families or those attorneys are hiring professionals to help them with fiduciary services along the way and so one of those professionals I've come across and we interviewed our channel before we had a great discussion invit back is Karyn Stiles with Lassahn Fiduciary. Karyn, thank you so much for joining us today sure thanks for having me little background how did you end up in fiduciary Services yeah good question it's a kind of a niche career and it wasn't very widely known about obviously we're coming into a different time with a lot of Baby Boomers and a lot of wealth transfer so it's becoming more popular now but it started for me as a as a family gig and my cousin started the company almost 30 years ago and someone just kind of mentioned it to her you know you should you should try this and then my sister joined and I joined when I graduated college I left to go get my CPA license and I came back my CPA license Devils is a fiary license and I've been back with the company for many years but it's a you know it's a you do have to be pretty well-rounded it's a lot of Finance it's a lot of you have to know some real estate you have to know tax you have to know finance and insurance but then you also have to sometimes care for you know individuals while they're alive so that's how I got into it and it's just kind of you know I love all of those things sounds weird but so I stuck with it you can't help but notice if you go to the website Len fiduciary dcom we have a link in the chat box to find on about Karen you can scroll past Kelsey who looks amazingly like and has

4:12 The same last name so I knew there's some nepotism in there somehow along the way but good for you must be fun to work with your sister yeah sister and cousin and then we also have another set of sisters in the office so w we tend to hire people that are close to us and so it's a really there are 14 of us now we happen to be all women and you know I guess the best referral is a word of mouth and sometimes that happens to be a sibling so what's the most common trust or state or situation that you manage what's the most I mean I'm sure there a wide range and I know the nature businesses there's a wide range but if you were try to summarize what's the most common size the most common scenario that you get involved with yeah I mean you're right it's very such a wide variety you know we the three of us are also on the court list so we do we get conservatorships and I think everyone knows what a conservatorship is now because of Britney Spears so we work with those so you know that could be just a wide range of either issues or Financial levels I would say the majority of our clients you know we're on the peninsula in the Bay Area and if you have a house it's over a million so I would say you know for asset levelwise it's you know probably about four million and we also choose you know we're a pretty established firm you know we have we're larger than most and so we don't take a lot of clients that we won't be the most efficient for you know we're more than happy to talk to people and point them in the right direction but we're also not the most you know the least expensive so sometimes it's just not efficient for us to take clients that don't have over a million

6:16 Or two million not saying that we won't we you know we are we like to hear stories and talk to people so there's always that route but most are you can be you can get into a trust many different ways one is the actual grantors the people making the trust write you in you know they see this happening they don't have kids their kids are not financially Savvy they live out of state you know they see what's coming and they plan for themselves and they write us into their trust and then we don't talk to them for many years and when we're needed we step in another route that happens fre unfortunately is that a child is the trustee and as soon as that happens very common between siblings that all of a sudden you're not brother and sister anymore or sister and sister you are trustee and beneficiary so that relationship can change and cause a lot of turmoil especially when there's any already you know wounds from the past a lot of the times there is fighting very expensive fighting and in instead of continuing that fighting their settlement is really to ask a third party to come in and administer so we do that and then a lot of vacancies so a lot of people in their trust name their brother their sister their cousin their neighbor all of whom are the same age as them and when you do that you're kind of making a gamble you know who is going to be alive last and if you're the same age if you're 80 and you need someone to help you and your neighbor's also 80 are they going to want to do it and so are they able to do it are you able yeah and so a lot of the times you know we've been named fourth in line in a trust you know really just as a backup right and we've and we've gotten called because of that

8:19 Reason and so yeah so a lot of times there can be a vacancy in that trustee position which is when we can step in also so as a fiduciary your job is you know no different than the executor or administrator you're playing the role of that person right you're stepping in for them and doing the work for them and so you know we call this Probate Weekly but really probate in California is where trusts are litigated and conservatorships are litigated and guardianships are kind of so I picked that term to kind of be more broad and so when you are stepping in taking in what are the most common duties I mean how for example what percentage of time is the Real Estate that needs to be disposed of for example maybe the seed residence or investment properties that need to be disposed as opposed to properties that are held for continued investment almost every case you know there are occasionally for example I just I had a trust where most of the property was distributed in kind so we didn't have to sell it went outright to a beneficiary so occasionally that will happen sometimes especially if there's more than one child that's not always the greatest choice because of difference in values and keeping it even if that's what the parent wants to do so I would say I mean I would say 99% of our clients have real estate and unless a child wants to buy out the other children then we do have to sell it and liquidate it so it's it is almost every case you know it's at different times so obviously when you know we have clients that are living and we don't sell their properties right out from under them unless it's absolutely necessary one spouse passes the other one's still alive they want to stay in the house most commonly right so you know it comes in time

10:25 It's not you know we get on and sell but we do many real estate transactions and I want to give you an estimate per year but I don't even know what that is okay so I imagine some of your business comes from Real Estate related people whether they're the customer or the real estate agent reduce the customer to them and you're going to respect that relationship other times there's no relationship identified and in those cases does the customer tell you oh we want to use Betty Boop the Realtor® or do you say you know this is kind of a specialized business we want to have some that we know can do the job properly and you recommend somebody or I imagine there was a combination of those two yeah you're right so I'm selling a house right now and the client the beneficiary is involved and he found the Realtor® and he wanted to use her and then I kind of do the vetting you know I make sure she's legitimate and I also get we always get more than one proposal so for every real estate trans action you know we do we have at least two or three Realtors® give us their proposal but if a client does have a Realtor® in mind we definitely put them in with those proposals and you know we want to use someone that they want to use so as long as that Realtor® you know is legitimate and we feel comfortable with that then we will use them most of the time beneficiaries are not that heavily involved in the administration and so you know we do use Realtors® you know what's important to us is that the Realtor® is mostly in that area you know they really do specialize in certain areas and we've had just some issues with you know Southern California Realtors® that were hired to be sell something up here and it just it hasn't worked out that smoothly and that's really we didn't

12:28 Hire them they were you know already there but so we tend to find somebody you know Word of Mouth someone local in that area or at least willing to do the work and the research to be there what does a proposal that you like or what would you like to see in a proposal and what kinds of things you see are unnecessary or detrimental in a proposal for real estate agent applying for the job to sell property yeah that's a good question I'm happy you asked it's you know for us it's important you we just need to be aware you know what if all of a sudden we're selling the house and we're told oh you need to spend $50,000 putting lipstick on it like well we didn't you know decide on that when we were selling it or you know when we were getting the proposals so we just want to be aware what do you think needs to be done to the property you do we really need to do a kitchen remodel we don't really do that much anymore more or does it just need some lipstick and what are the estimated costs I would also you know quotes or estimates for what we're going to spend on those things is very helpful we have people you know inhouse that can do that hourly so it's nice for us to compare and obviously you know the realator taking more of that off of our hands is wonderful so that's something you know disclosure about pricing to fix it up or get it ready to sell whether they think it needs to be staged also their fees you know their percentage what it should be listed at and why you know different comparables and then also what it's listed at but also what our goal price is you know and so why is that the price so those are those are some items and the car comparables

14:35 Are really important to us because we do we do look at those and you know some houses are hard to compare so just doing the best that we can so to just to kind of go dig a Little Deeper on cost of fix of property you know I know there's the common School thought is most reals will talk about staging and fixing things up and painting and as though that's going to get and it will get a higher gross sales price my question always is will it net you more money and also if you count for the time if the asset is off the market for three days or longer you know there's also you're paying your taxes Insurance risking squatters and just sitting there as a dead asset and so I generally tell customers there's nothing besides securing the property and safety that will really you more net bottom line now I'm in the minority on that so go ahead and tell me the opposite or what you see when have you seen cases where it made sense to do more than say just secure the property clean the property up make it safe when have you seen times when more than that and staging is another one in particular that you know L Realtors® will point to the headline of an article says I'll staging get you more money but when you read the headline or read the article really it just says staging in study is about taking out trash and putting things away it doesn't talk about bringing in furniture and paying for it so I'm just curious where you are that I know that you're doing with hiring customers and they're more susceptible to the well we want our house to look pretty I think fallacy yeah I actually I actually don't disagree with you but I think it does highly depend on the property and the timing you know sometimes like right now if we needed to sell a house right now we're not going to list it right now you know we have three weeks or so to list it after the New Year and so we do have a little bit of time to get it

16:42 Ready if we needed to with that being said between the Realtor® and us you know this is our full-time job we're not a typical customer who has an a 9 to-5 and then is doing this in their spare time you know this is the we involved so we can normally get things done very quickly between the Realtor® and our office so having the house off the market you know for the 30 days or the two months you know that's normally not an issue you know we have a plan with the Realtor® also something to put in the proposal when it should be listed and so that doesn't worry me and then it just totally depends on the house you know I'll give some examples you know we just sold a house that quite literally didn't have a roof on it and we've sold a house that was pigeon infested or you know just a really dilapidated houses those are fun it's not fun but you know when that when there are scenarios like that we know someone's just going to come in and wipe the whole thing out and so we're not going to waste time or money doing anything to it and then there are other you know the most common is you know an elderly person who lives in their house and doesn't have the same style as everybody else and I think Realtors® may you know the ones that I've talked to that we've done this for and myself you know buying a house and selling houses you know people don't have that great of imaginations and so when you do deliver a property to them that's severely outdated it's hard for people to imagine what they can do with it and so I do think lightening it up sometimes you know if there's you know we had a house with bright pink walls and Pink Carpet and popcorn ceiling that does lower the value a little bit and so for us to be

18:47 Able to get all that out and done in two days to make it look so much brighter and bigger and you know the perception of the property to buyers I think that is beneficial but you're right you know cost benefit how much does it cost and how much you know are we going to get for it but I do think and you know the more offers we have the more we can let them you know fight against each other so I do think it's important to get those offers and when the house you know looks better looks bigger looks brighter and gives people the ability to imagine what they can do with it I think that we'll get more bids so in turn I think that could turn out well but again every property is very different you hit it spot on with the you know with people living there or vacant homes you know it is really dangerous especially for us we have a super high liability issue in our in our business and you know if you have just regular homeowners insurance and nobody's living there that is not sufficient you know you do have to have a vacant home policy and this is really important and I think most you know nonprofessional fiduciaries or you know people selling houses don't necessarily think of this and that's it's a lot more expensive than just a normal homeowners probably for that reason you know squatters people know that you're not there they then they can go and steal and so that is definitely a little bit more expensive and a good tip for clients you know just make sure that people tell their insurance brokers their insurance agent that the home is vacant and switch it to a vacant home policy for however long you need right otherwise you're asking for trouble in California today you're really asking for trouble U real quick let's do some housekeeping real quick just to make sure everybody

20:50 Knows where we're at this is Probate Weekly we do this every Thursday at 9:00 a.m. Pacific time and we 12:00 noon eastern time we live stream it on YouTube oops that's my spot there we live we live stream this as well on to YouTube then we'll broadcast on Facebook and Linkedin as well and then you continue the conversation on Facebook we have a Facebook group called also Probate Weekly where not only can you ask questions and we'll answer them but you can also post your content and here's an example Kevin bmel is one of our you know favorites where he'll post re's another one they'll post their YouTube videos that are related to probate and Trust real estate and that way we can help each other get more views and engage the conversation he has all kinds of great questions and answers that go on there you can register at www.probateweekly.com and just put your phone number if you want text reminders put in your phone number and you'll get invited to the zoom call if you want to as well as the live stream for YouTube Facebook and linked on the replay you scroll down you can also catch us other audio formats as well as see the past episodes on YouTube Our Guest today is with laen fiduciary Services we'll put in the chat box laen fiduciary docomo to find her on the and you scroll down suspiciously what they look alike and they got the same last name what's going on here I suspect some nepotism of course it is it's your sister so there you go so thank you for being on today Karen so let's talk about obviously there's real estate and what I kind of call the world of regular real estate right there's marketing the real estate there's preparing the real estate there's you know evaluating it pricewise but there's also occasionally not every case and I would say in a minority specialized real estate contracts skills information related to probate and Trust real estate that's happens in my particular area and I deal more with

22:53 Probate cases and litigation and I know that's not the majority of your cases you're not always getting ation but you I'm sure you come across them so talk a little bit about what types of cases do you think need somebody with some special AED agent May with some special knowledge or understanding or do you just assume they're not going to have it and you feel in the void with the attorney a good question a little bit of both you know I think where it makes a difference for us is when having somebody that's familiar with selling a house you know with a trustee or a fiduciary kind of the administrative side and really you know us and the attorney and the real estate agent work together but it's really helpful when the real estate agent has done that before or knows what's involved you know sometimes in probates escro or title companies will require notice of proposed actions and you know knowing upfront or at least having the Realtor® ask the escrow title company if they're going to need that is super helpful I'm in the process of selling one right now and the Realtor® has done some work for us in the past and he reached out to me and said I'm gonna ask the title so just so we don't have any issues you know right it's going to be an all cash offer this is the one with no roof on it and so instead of accepting an offer that's a 10-day close if we do need a nopa you know we need time to send that out and have it verified so he did all of that upfront and when we were accepting offers we said okay we cannot close until you know we need a 20-day close so even an offer with 10day close we said we need 20 and obviously they may not care but you know so knowing things on the legal side and a lot of that comes just with experience you know that's super helpful

24:59 Also in the titling you know I think a lot of people in general not you know just real EST estate agents but a lot of people don't understand what a trust is or an estate and so you know signing my name you know K. Stiles Trustee of blah trust or you know special administrator executive you know what those titles are and what should act actually be on the listing agreement on all the signing documents and obviously we you know we look at everything we're signing so we can correct it if need be but having someone knowing what documents they're looking at and also knowing what documents are going to be needed at title you know looking at the title report and are there any nuances you know we had an old loan from 1983 on this title report that luckily you know they researched and found before you know we needed to close again just so that there are no hiccups so I would say you know learning about what a trust versus a will versus probate special administrator you know all of those terms kind of mean just to have a general understanding is a little bit helpful and then and then the work needed which mostly the attorney deals with but even having a you know you know we have a lot of clients going on and sometimes we forget to but you know checking the paperwork and making sure that we're act our name is actually on the house right on the title because a lot of the times we get on and the county has not processed the change in ownership and so making sure that those documents are included in the in the escrow package and I'd say that's actually really common you know I got on to a case in September and

27:03 Now we're selling the house well the county obviously hasn't you know process that paperwork to add my name right so just making sure all of that is readily available so lots of impact if I can just go back a little bit for those who may not be in California and familiar with it or those in California not familiar she used the term NOPA, notice of proposed action so in a probate in California you have two types limited authority needs a Court to prove it very structured process very detailed process about 10% of cases when there's either limited authority or litigation require the court to approve it those that don't where they have full Authority you still need to in many cases send out in know to propose action to all interested parties so that they have a chance to object and this is a mispo oftentimes people know they has to get done and so they'll have the property and the last minute oh we forgot to send out the nopa and as K points out either you have to wait 10 days for it to expire you notice them properly hopefully and then you wait 10 days and follow the court or worse they might say no I jacked you're selling it too cheap you're selling it to my brother's friend and I think we're getting ripped off here now you have a whole big problem and so you need to know that process so the notice of proposed action is really critical to strategize how do you want to do it when do you want to send it out is everybody on board with this or is there somebody lurking that's going to cause a problem and that's why speed's so important she also mentioned about the title report and I think it's best practice for any real estate agent in California every TI company will allow us to order the primary title report as soon as we list the property there's no excuse for not getting it and getting to work on it right away and I think she know she points out every es company wants to wait till the last second to clear everything and the problem is that last second might take them a week or two to clear it versus if we get the preum up front hey what's this 1983 mortgage it's been paid off let's get started on it now get the documents that then we do that and the last she pointed out again I sorry to pack here but you're just you're so full of good information knowing the titles I think real estate

29:05 Agents we just don't take the time to realize the importance there's a distinction between executor, which means you're written the will to execute the will administrator which means you're not but you're filing to do the will the state truste special administrators another term and I think that when you show when you use the right term you show the other professionals like the fiduciary you take this seriously and there's no excuse not to I mean it's on a piece of paper somewhere and it doesn't change really during the course generally speaking during the course of transactions so I think it's important to learn the right term and then make sure your documents have that right term Joe Smith comma special administrator Joe Smith comma you know executive of the such and such state so she points out some great stuff there and again K I just feel like you're giving some great gold to her make sure we all pick up the nuggets and knows what they are what would you say is the biggest mistake that you've seen a real estate agent who works with your firm maybe they're brought in by the customer or maybe you pick them you know unwittingly and what are the most common mistakes that you see the real agents make that you think that they should be able to avoid with some proper training or Preparation you know I feel really lucky that I don't know that we've come across too many mistakes you and you know I think that comes in part by one the real state agent being professional and then two you know us as a as a backup that do it quite often and so gosh I think you know and it's hard because a lot of the things that go wrong in the transaction is not necess not always the real estate agent's fault you know it's because we didn't know there was a loan on the title or you know some something like that so you know I can't even think of some major issues I think the only you know service issue that we've had

31:10 Is that real estate agents maybe because we are there and we can pick up the slack and they work with us a lot and it's our job I think sometimes they assume that we can just do it and you know for us it's a business also and the less time we spend the less time we need to pay our employee to go do this for you right or for the sale is better for us so I'd say making it as easy as possible on the client I mean that's you know this is your service this is what you're getting paid for you know that's very helpful and sometimes we are relied on because it's our job too and we need to kind of remind Realtors® well no wait a minute we are paying you for this so you know meeting like we've been asked to meet people there with the key we've been asked wow and it's not our job to show the property right and even you know handing off the keys to the other Realtor® all of those things because someone was on vacation you know that is something that and I think it's hard because we're not a typical client you know we this is our job and it's not necessarily a personalized property for us but just keeping that in mind you know you are getting paid just the same and we do expect the same if not better service and you know although we can be relied on in times of an emergency where something really needs to happen and we're quick we get it done you know we don't want to too you know we do expect to I guess we have high expectations you know we do expect to hire somebody that can do the best job for us and not necessarily making us step in again real quick reminder that if

33:13 You're interested asking questions raise your hand in the zoom chat or put it in the chat box you guys are awfully quiet these days the whole reason we moved from a video format on YouTube to zoom was I think as a coach you guys need to participate more and ask questions get a chance to meet professionals like this I think it'd be hard to get a chance to meet with Karen in person and that's why we have this call today so feel free you know we're going to enter our last segment here so you know towards that Karen I you know I asked about the mistake I think you know you really point out something that I experienced as well which is you know a lot of the mistakes go away when you work with really good people I know for me as a l you know I work with lenders or title or escrow I want to work with the best and I know when I do things fall into place I know when I don't everything fall like the wheels just fall off when I when I succumb to the other agent to use a title rep doesn't nobody's doing or the es doesn't know what they're doing I just recommend old gilapy and the wheels are falling off the steering wheel falls off and the whole thing just comes to a halt and at times we had to switch back and go back to the main vendor but you want to be somebody who does the job properly so on the flip side then I think you point out a couple opportunities and I would Point them out for people on the call of ways to create value what can we do as Realtors® obviously you know every data company wants to tell us oh find out who follows these Estates and coold call them I don't want to do that I want to meet you because my C do that yeah please don't there you go and don't and don't send out random junk mail don't send out random email I wouldn't I did because I was coach too and I realize it was a waste of time but I much rather do is have customers who meet people or have these circumstances and then earn the relationship by going above and beyond and so she pointed out a couple I think if you listen closely to those opportunities often times they're going to go to the house to secure it or get a u get kind of a situation report on the property but at the same time we can go there and we can drive around the property and take pictures and knock on the door we can go and get keys change the locks we can go and you know give an assessment of what

35:16 What has to be done before they go to the property for example po dropping off Keys picking up of course we should go to their office what a great opportunity to meet the People by getting in the office they'll say I can't get in the office because they're so closed and secure yeah but when they want to hand you the keys you get a chance to meet the front desk oh and by the way the lady at the front desk or the guy at the front desk they're even more valuable than Karen because they deal with people all day long or they'll go to Karen and say I met the guy Bill he was really nice like that's what you want right you bring him or her a Starbucks you have a best friend and they're go back and tell Karen how great you are and Karen's going call you back and say hey we need somebody like you regularly so what are some of the things that the better Partners do for you that help you so that you say gosh I wish next time we worked for that person rather than just some random real estate agent yeah I'm happy I'm happy you're asking and I do think this is a little bit of preference you know every fiduciary or person in general may be different on you know what they like with a professional relationship from our from our office standpoint we don't like to be bombarded you know we who does yeah we do have a lot of people in our pocket but with that being said we always do want more you know we don't we do not we always have to mix up our Realtors® you know we are not allowed to receive gifts or compensation or referral fees and we will not accept them you know that's not something we can do and so keep that in mind you know someone may reject your gift and it's not because they don't like you or they don't like it we just legally are not allowed to accept anything in return but I think you know there are definitely some professionals we stay away from because it's too much you know it's

37:19 It's we are busy we have full-time jobs and you know when people do ask us to coffee or to lunch we often decline because if we did that with everybody that asked us it'd be way too much time and so I would say you know again this is this is personal every fiduciary may be different but the way to get in with us is you know yeah a brief you know hey can I first of all let us know you're coming can I stop by and give you my brochure and just you know let you know what I can do for you five minutes you know that's all I need I am more than happy to meet people and hear what they have to say and what they can do for us and areas they specialize in I will tell you that every cold call I get on a property I ignore most of the time people call me and they say hi I you know I noticed you just became on as trustee can I sell the property I'm like he's living you know no I'm not going to sell the his house from him so I do I do ignore those that's not a good use of my time right but I would say you know just very brief check-ins yes if you wanted to schedule just a five minute can I come by and you know deliver my brochure and let you know what I can do that is totally fine and you know again I think the areas you specialize in and the types of houses you specialize in is really beneficial a good way you know to do that is just to let us know and it's really as simple as that and I maybe that sounds to the Realtor® like you're not doing enough but I do promise you know I have a stack of business cards in my in my drawer that I do keep and we have a list of people and sometimes you know we will ask you for a

39:24 Proposal and you're not gonna you're not going to get the house and typically we do that a couple times before we actually hire you so you know there is some upfront work but you know that's kind of what we have to do our due diligence especially if we don't know someone or haven't worked with them before so there's a key point there that you'll often and I think you mentioned ask maybe two or three most agents for a proposal you only to pick one obviously so that means at best you're get wi of three if new you might do that a few times you might do that five times before you get one and I always tell Realtors® well I would do 10 proposals to get a listing you know you know it's not that much work with technology today and such if you know the area in a proposal what you know I and I get phone calls from attorneys fueres and say can you give me an estimate value in this property or broker's price pin what do you like that report to look like what's too much CU I know I see some and I ask for Realtor® in another city for a referral and I feel I get this whole big you know song and dance but I don't get the actual data and the numbers that I want to make a decision on what do you look for in a proposal from a Realtor® that causes you want to do business with them versus when where you say there's a lot of fluff here and I don't think they really know what they're doing yeah I would say in that in that scenario the fluff doesn't bother me you know as long as it's a thorough thought out proposal it doesn't bother me it also doesn't impress me you know it's the substance of The Proposal so I've received emails which you know it does say the property what they're going to do estimated timing costs and then also a blurb about themselves and their experience and you know I've received that in an email I've also received you know a binder hard copy binded professionally done and you know I can't help but be impressed by that you know it took effort and that

41:26 You know that shows effort and professionalism however I do think the majority is what's in that report so I'm not necessarily blinded by the fluff it is the quality of the of the substance and what's in the report got it okay and is there any besides stopping by perhaps dropping off a flyer you know when you're called putting together nice proposal is there anything else that Ro agents can do to offer you for example a particular service is research information helpful do you notice on social media you say wow this person seems to really know that area and as a result them business with them or do you go to network advance and meet people there what else would you recommend somebody since we know cold calling isn't an answer what else might you recommend somebody who's trying to break in the business and was worthy of your business to get your attention yeah totally so there are a lot of professional fiduciary events that I recommend going to and you can sponsor them I wouldn't over sponsor you know I do you know just as a reminder you know giving people a little nudge and reminding them of your name every once in a while is sufficient I don't think you need to sponsor five times a year but there is if you go on to the PAC website Pac is professional fiduciaries association of California for us in California and there is a list of professional fiduciaries there we also have monthly meetings and so we have a lot of realators come to that meeting it's a lunch meeting and we typically have education and so you do have to sit through the education whatever that topic may be but there's 30 minutes networking beforehand yep that's it and each you know there are different chapters we're in the Sano chapter and so there are a lot of different chapters and you

43:29 Can all the meetings are on there and events there are also some larger educational conferences that you can go to I will say you know the monthly chapter meetings are a lot more intimate you know we have about 30 people the larger you know events and CPE education events I think you really need to be a sponsor it for people to see you because it's a lot harder but there are also tons of you know during those events a lot of networking you know cocktail hours and things like that and we always talk to people you know at those and get business cards and you know the more people you know the better because there are a lot of really you know quality Realtors® and attorneys and people out there that we want you know we want to work with the best so I think it's beneficial and I think that's a really good way to meet fiduciaries so the website I put there was pfac for professional fooder association California hyen pr.org pacen pro.or and they have a great chapter near Med and Long Beach I went to you talked about the education and while maybe sometimes those are necessary evils I remember going to one about oh what was the term they used hex petitions there was an attorney who gave a and as a real estate agent I don't really know what that was about but what a valuable tool to learn and this particular attorney actually gave a copy of his filing so that when I talk to other attorneys I say hey I Happ to have the filing from this very well-known attorney Long Beach that you can look at and use and whatever to incorporate into your pleadings and it just was such a valuable experience that to be honest it was more valuable than the networking so I was looking at the topics now a lot of them get to be very gran for me as a Realtor® or you know appropriate for fiduciaries but I would

45:32 Definitely say take a look at the education as a way to improve yourself rather than just focusing on the networking part but I think it's definitely worth we've also had realators you could always offer to the chapter we've had realators speak especially you know property managers realators who also do Property Management we've had them come speak and talk to us about liability issues and really the benefits of having you know like a property manager versus doing it yourself and the California laws especially but so even Realtors® you know coming and speaking or off if you want to offer a topic you know that's been we're learning from Realtors® too so I'd love to do a speech to a fies and attorneys on court confirmed sales the 35 mistakes I have a list of every mistake I've seen made on those as well as in California just reading the probate notes I like I should be training real attorneys on I don't know if you get involved in that with the litigation but sometimes the attorneys aren't aware that the judge kind of gives them the sheet and if you don't read it then you're just kind of walking blind but to me just you kind telling the judge you don't you're doing if you don't review those my two pet peeves so okay I'm sure you have yours as well I don't me to go on okay look I thought this is really helpful I appreciate the opportunity to get into depth I don't see any outstanding questions I think we covered everything so K I think I'm just going to say thank you so much that I know this time of year on one hand we're busy trying to wrap stuff up on other hand you're also trying to out the door to get your family and friends so I really appreciate take a time to share with us educate us if somebody had more questions or if they had a particular trust or state that needed professional fiduciary or maybe they questions about that what's the best way to get in contact with you or find out yeah I mean you can always give the office a call or send me an email more than happy to answer any questions

47:34 That come up you know this life is a learning process and you know getting if somebody wants to know something about what we do or you know it's very juicy and interesting I think so I think so good so the website is Lawson Financial Services Lawson is the company the s office numbers on the top 650 57893 and the website I just covered it up because I'm So Fancy with my Services here hold on a second it's the whole name Lan fisher.com Lan fuer I knew I knew I get the accent wrong whichever way I went I was like which way do you go with that one it's gonna be wrong Just Go With It Sonia very nice thank you for time Ken thanks so much your time happy holidays Merry Christmas and happy New Year and thank you so much for being with us today I really appreciate it thank you thank you for having me happy holidays and for R you this is live streamed on to YouTube you're welcome to see the replay there as well we do this every week now we're going to be off for the next two weeks for the holidays so you can we'll replay some of our best episodes there but you go to app B probate on YouTube and see our past episodes you can go to Probate Weekly.com to sign up as well as see the past episodes I really appreciate you guys time if I can help with anything please reach out if I speak to you have a happy holiday Merry Christmas Happy Hanukkah and a happy New Year thank you everybody thanks so much